“It’s nice to watch people be nice to each other.” That’s the line you most often hear someone use when they talk up Apple’s breakout smash hit Ted Lasso. But while the story of Jason Sudeikis’s relentlessly optimistic American coach navigating the unfamiliar waters of England’s Premier League football may provide some kind-hearted highs, those moments only land in contrast to the real and traumatic lows experienced by all of the show’s characters. Chief among the traumatized this season is retired midfielder Roy Kent who walks through life like a clenched fist, occasionally only communicating in monosyllabic grunts. Roy begins the show’s second season happily in love with Juno Temple’s Keeley Jones but still adrift without his lifelong love affair with football to ground him. As played by Ted Lasso writer Brett Goldstein, Kent is a character who might be equally at home in a gritty drama, but he shines in contrast to Sudeikis’s aw shucks routine. This week’s episode, “Rainbow,” closes with a soaring score, a dramatic — if hobbled — run, and Roy Kent finally coming home to ecstatic cheers on the AFC Richmond pitch.
For Goldstein, Roy Kent is the hard-fought role of a lifetime. In a story he’s told again and again at this point, Goldstein took a wild swing putting himself on tape and pitching himself for a part that was a far cry from the much softer roles he played earlier in his career. Goldstein not only landed the part, he scooped up an Emmy nomination for Supporting Actor in a Comedy Series alongside three of his Ted Lasso co-stars. Goldstein is funny even when he’s just growling and Roy Kent is endearing, especially when his gruff exterior bumps up against Temple’s Keeley or Elodie Blomfield as Roy’s niece Phoebe. But there are darker themes intruding on every Ted Lasso storyline this season and Goldstein wants to make sure audiences see the storms as well as the sunshine. That is, after all, the only way you get a rainbow.
Vanity Fair: Last season obviously ends with this big decision for Roy Kent to leave the team and retire but that left audiences wondering how he would stay in the middle of the action of the show. What conversations did you have in the writer’s room about waiting five entire episodes to bring him back into the fold?
Brett Goldstein: There were a million different ways Roy could have turned out, but Jason has a very good rule of look at the script, look at the characters, and the answer is almost always there. Roy is incredibly stubborn. It’s going to take five episodes to get him over the emotional hump. I think part of what we’re interested in exploring in Roy is what happens after football and what happens to a man like this. You’ve got his relationship, which has been amazing and probably the first time he’s had a relationship this good. But, you know, the rest of his life’s a fucking mess. So he’s in denial about that. He’s like, everything’s fine.
There was an extraordinary interview you gave in the earliest days of the show where you talked about how if you asked someone like Roy Kent in his twenties about what he wanted to do after football he would say kill himself. That there is no post-football for Roy Kent. How much are you actively engaging with an idea like that in Season 2?
That’s the thing about Roy Kent. I think he completely meant that. He’d play football until he died. The thing that he hadn’t planned on was Keeley. Firstly, Ted gets Roy to open his heart a bit. But then the arrival of Keeley into his life is what has kept him on. He’s not going to kill himself, it’s not the end of the world. But I think we can already see there’s a danger in how much he’s investing in his relationship with Keeley versus the rest of his life.
I love that even though we’re all invested in Roy and Keeley, the big trope-y rom-com run-through-the-airport moment in the show is Roy running towards football.
I loved it. It was insanely long, that run, because I think each tiny bit of that sequence was filmed over like two and a half weeks. So when I did finally get there…there’ve been so many moments on this job that feel like magic but the moment where I walked back onto the pitch for the first time with a crowd and they’re doing the Roy Kent chant. Just walking out you get goosebumps and it’s really fucking special. Again, the longer you hold off, the more hopefully satisfying it is.
Roy Kent comes home to AFC Richmond.
Courtesy of Apple TV+Because this episode in particular deals so much in the idea of love and romance as a life line, I wanted to talk about how much I enjoy Roy and Keeley as not a “will they/won’t they” couple but as a “watch how they do it” couple.
The film that I go on about and drive people mad is Don’t Look Now with Julie Christie and Donald Sutherland. It’s the best married couple acting you have ever seen in any film, the way they are together. It’s such a wonderful thing to watch and the way they behave with each other feels so natural and so lived in. Juno and I both watched that film a lot and try to be as natural and comfortable with each other.
You’ve said before that the writers weren’t influenced by fan reaction to Season 1 when crafting Season 2, but the first season was such a phenomenon and viewers were so vocal in their praise. How hard is it to shut that all out?
Listen, I think it’s really, really hard. You have to remember that the thing you made, you made it the way you made not listening to these million other voices. You know what I mean? How we made the thing was not crowdsourced. It’s quite tricky mentally because it’s so wonderful to read the lovely things. It plays in my mind every single day and equally you have to develop some skill where you can switch that off so you can concentrate on this story we’re telling.
It reminds me a lot of what’s going on with Nate this season who has had a large amount of success but it all seems to be taking up too much space in his brain. That he’s falling into that feedback trap.
I can’t say much because I don’t want to spoil anything. I think it’s a really interesting storyline. I think there are elements of it that when I saw it all come together in the edit, I felt really proud to be part of this. This is really complicated adult stuff with all the ugliness. I also think that Nick Mohammed is brilliant.
You mention some of that ugliness that the show engages in. Of course it’s gotten this reputation for being a cozy feel-good show but that’s only part of what’s going on with Ted Lasso. I find it goes to some really profound places. Especially in Season 2.
Jason says, and I do agree with him, that the funny stuff is easy. Without sounding pretentious, if you get the emotional truth right, then you’re set. Then the funny stuff you can pile on as much or as little as you want. I give all the credit to Jason, Brendan and Joe. When they were originally coming up with the TV pilot the question was why is Ted Lasso here. He’d left his wife.
It’s funny you mention that because while I liked the first few episodes of Season 1, I didn’t love the show until Episode 5 when Ted’s wife and son come to the UK. And that’s the episode you have a writing credit on!
I mean, you’ve got excellent taste.
That’s the episode where you really see the melancholy running through the show and I appreciate that we’re getting even more of that in Season 2.
I think Season 2 — it’s funny — but I think it’s darker and even more adult. I love the love that you see for Ted Lasso, but there’s also, I think, a kind of simplification of the show. Particularly from people who haven’t seen it and are only aware of the hype and probably get annoyed with it. Like “oh it’s just a lovely show where everyone’s lovely to each other!” Know what I mean? That’s what it sounds like it is. But it’s also incredibly dark and difficult. I am always surprised when people say it made them feel warm and fuzzy inside. His wife left him. The team got relegated. Rebecca’s been in a horrifically abusive marriage. Like it’s dark, it’s really dark. But it is about people being their best selves in difficult circumstances. There’s a lot of darkness in it and there’s so much swearing and that’s mostly me but that people still think it’s sort of family fluff. Fascinating.
Speaking of the swearing etc., Roy Kent doesn’t really sound like you. Where do you get that voice and do you go through a lot of lozenges to maintain it?
It’s a manifestation of the fact that he is covering feelings that he cannot let out. He has to keep his voice almost like a cork and hold everything down. Because if he let it out, he’d be a wreck. You know what I mean?
A lot is made in the show about Roy being a midfielder. Since I’m pretty ignorant when it comes to the world of football, what’s the psychological profile of a midfielder? How does that inform how you play him?
It’s as much about being a midfielder as it is about being team captain. It’s about being captain as much as anything like his job is. Uh, I mean, I spoke with a lot of football Premiership captains and part of the job is intimidation. It’s scaring the other team. That’s why Roy stands like a gunslinger ready to fire at all times.
Plenty of UK football fans have pointed out that midfielder Roy Keane might be an inspiration for your character. Is there any truth in that?
If you’re asking me, which you are, I say there’s zero. I know who I’ve based him on and that’s [Oliver Twist villain] Bill Sykes if he hadn’t killed Nancy. And [Roy’s niece] Phoebe is his dog Bullseye.
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